In this episode, we dive into a lively showdown between two powerful strategies for nurturing relationships: email marketing vs. online communities.
You'll hear us engage in a playful showdown, where we throw down our best arguments for why our preferred method is the ultimate way to nurture relationships. As we explore the virtues of each approach, you'll learn about the power of automation and the certainty of email marketing, and the real-time engagement and community-building magic that comes from private online spaces.
🎧 So, whether you're team email or team community, or just curious about how to nurture your connections, this episode is packed with fun banter and valuable takeaways!
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Automation in Email Marketing: One of the standout points from our discussion is the incredible efficiency that email marketing offers through automation. With just a little upfront effort, you can create content that continues to nurture your audience for years to come. Imagine spending an hour crafting a message that can be reused and repurposed over a decade! This longevity allows you to stay top-of-mind with your audience, even if they don’t open every email. Email marketing shines with its ability to automate and reuse content over time. You can create a nurturing sequence that continues to engage your audience for years, maximizing the value of your efforts.
Real-Time Engagement in Online Communities: On the flip side, we explored the dynamic nature of online communities. Unlike email, where messages can get lost in crowded inboxes, a private online community allows for real-time interaction and engagement. Members can set their preferences to see exactly what they want, fostering a more personalized experience. This two-way communication not only builds stronger relationships but also empowers members to support each other, creating a vibrant ecosystem of collaboration.
Choose What Fits Your Style: Ultimately, the episode emphasizes that the best approach depends on your personal strengths and preferences. Whether you lean towards email marketing or online communities, aligning your strategy with your unique style will yield the best results.
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Explore Email Marketing Tools: Check out Lisa’s Tools for Coaches membership group and consider using Kit to access pre-built email sequences and automations that can simplify your email marketing efforts.
Engage in Online Communities: Consider creating or joining a private online community to facilitate real-time interactions and connections. Start with the Lead Through Strengths Podcast Meetup, hosted by Brea.
Experiment with Content: Test different types of content in both email and community settings. For email, consider sending personalized messages that feel genuine, while in a community, encourage members to share their insights and support each other.
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Lisa: I'm Lisa. or Mrs. T
Brea: I'm Brea. Iced T
Lisa: And, uh, we have our alter egos with us today because we're doing a showdown, like a rap battle about nurturing with email marketing or with a community. And it's the battle. I, Mrs. T, I'm there for the email marketing camp.
Brea: and Ice-T checking in, yo, yo, yo. I'm here for the online community. We gotta have a rap battle before we start. All right, okay. Yo, yo, yo, iced tea in the ring. I ain't here just to flex. I'm here to build something. Ooh, iced tea chases clout.
Lisa: Try to burn real quick, but I'm laying foundations brick by brick.
Brea: Oh, I feel burned, incinerated. You win. That was great.
Lisa: Gosh. And my positivity wants to stop immediately with the rap battle because I just want us to have mutual respect and not burn each other.
Brea: I mean, I do respect email marketing, but let's be honest, it's the worst.
Lisa: Online community all the way. I know. I'm in a tough camp, but as Mrs. T, I pity the fool that does not have email marketing on your side because it has so many virtues and people love to hate on it. It's not right.
Brea: I know. The irony is not lost on me that for probably six to seven years of my life, people paid me to write email campaigns for them, you know, and, and create funnels and all the things and I just am so over it. So yeah, I'm excited for the battle. Let's go.
Lisa: Okay, okay. Well, let's just start with the virtues of each and we get to give our debates about like, hey, this is why my thing is such a great thing. And of course, in the end, okay, spoiler alert for everyone. I know that communities are great. Bria knows that email marketing can be great. We believe that having both could be amazing, but we're totally gonna go with our characters and stay true to the one we're fighting for today.
Brea: Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight! Yeah.
Lisa: Right?
Brea: Oh my gosh.
Lisa: We're so tough. Can't you just feel the chains on me?
Brea: I know. I can see the like gold grill. Wait. Oh, that's Flava Flav with the big clock. Yeah. Anyways. Okay. Let's do it. I'm ready.
Lisa: Okay.
Brea: You want to go first?
Lisa: Sure. Okay. Let me give a major virtue of email marketing. I'm going to call it automation and systems, but the way this comes out is you can spend an hour building some content and you put it in your email system as an email and you added it to some nurture sequence or sequences, even better. You can spend that one hour and reuse it for A decade. And this is where email marketing shines because you can write that thing, put it in your systems, which takes a little bit more effort to create sequences and possibly tagging people by interest so it can be really individualized to them. And then you can reuse it eternally. I love that. You just get so much use out of your time.
Brea: Yeah. I mean, hello, Maximizer. I hear that for sure, for sure. So tell me, tell me how you're seeing this sustainability and the longevity from your email sequences. Like, are you actually reusing them year over year or quarterly? Or tell me, tell me more about that.
Lisa: Okay. So it can be, Yes, it can be reused. You're not going to remember something you saw two years ago that you may or may not have opened two years ago, right? So yes, you can reuse. If you make timeless content, it hits people different at different moments, different phases in their lives. So that's really cool. And then I think really. One of my other major, major loves for, and cases for email marketing is certainty. It's certainty that you can keep in touch every single one. lands in their box. And even if you don't open it, it keeps coming by. And after a handful of times, I know that person's name. So if they see Lisa Cummings lead through strengths and then they've been deleting it for six weeks and then they're like, oh yeah, I really need to focus on my strengths right now. And then they start reading them again. Or the best scenario that happens to me, people hit reply a year or more later and book me for events. It's happened over the 11 years I've been in business. It's happened many, many, many times. It's so cool. They've just been passively and lightly reading messages. I don't even know it, but they've been receiving them. Like, I've been on their mind in some small way, or Strengths has been on their mind in some small way, and then it's time to book their team retreat, and they're like, hey, we're doing a team retreat. Are you available on these days? That is so cool. So cool. Yeah. Yeah. It's such a cool value of email marketing that I've experienced over the years.
Brea: Yeah. Yeah. So this is interesting because I'm thinking of so many objections to what you're saying. I mean, I could tell you 10 ways that I'm certain that I have not read the emails that are in my email inbox. I actually have several what I call throwaway email addresses that I give to people specifically for promotions, right? And I don't ever check that email inbox, right? So I think what you're saying is the certainty is in relation to the algorithm. And so I think that's where I'm going to put online communities in the ring up against email marketing. That is something that I love about the online community. And I'm not talking about Facebook. I'm talking about private online community. So this is not a Facebook group or a LinkedIn group. This is a mighty network or a circle. This is a place where algorithms don't live. So here's where I think we agree. I am certain that every time I post something to my community, it will show up in their feed, you know, and they can set settings inside of your community to say, I want to see everything in my feed, or I only want to see posts about this strength, or I only want to see posts about live events or, you know, whatever. So they can really be in control of how much, how little, what type of content or they want to see everything, you know. And I think that that is so much better than social media and something similar, you know, with email marketing in that way.
Lisa: Yeah, if we had a battle rap with social media, we would both be dissing battle.
Brea: No, I appreciate social media, but social to me feels very similar to what you're talking about with emails, where even if people don't read it, they're seeing your name pop up, you know. But I think what I love about online communities is it allows me to really get my arms around people and really move from the nurturing to the building of the relationships. and engage even in real time. You can live stream from your community at any time. And if someone's just like doom scrolling on their phone or checking their emails on their phone, they'll get a pop-up notification that says, Bria went live and they can click and just talk to you live. That doesn't really happen in the same way with email. So there's pros and cons to it all, I guess. How do we even fight about it? Because it's like so many things to win about all of them.
Lisa: As the episode goes on, we're like, oh, yeah, that's a great idea. Yeah. Yeah.
Brea: That's right.
Lisa: I heard you to get back to one more debate point. This was probably a couple of months ago. You and I were talking and you were like, oh, the concept of email marketing hurts my individualization. And meanwhile, I was like, oh, my individualization and my top five loves email marketing. Can we have a little bit of that conversation? Tell us where, obviously, it's going to shine in a community for you, but let's just talk about the personal touch, the individualizing to the person you're interacting with, and how that plays into your vote and your view on email marketing and community.
Brea: I almost hate to talk about this on a podcast because I know that I'm especially sensitive to email marketing because I have spent so much time, I mean years with it, that I really just feel kind of burnt out by it. This is just me, this is my opinion, my experience, so take it with a grain of salt. But I think the automated fields that allow you to customize, like adding a variable, like a first name, or even their CliftonStrengths, or the company that they work at, or the place that you met them, or whatever variables you might put into an email template to make it feel more custom, it just doesn't get me anymore. I get that that's what's happening, so the magic is gone. As a consumer, there's nothing magical or personal about receiving a mass email. Because I don't love it as a customer, I just don't love it as a business owner. And I think that is my whole approach to this conversation is as a customer, I don't love it. I literally have email inboxes that I don't check ever. So I just, I assume that other people are that way too. I just don't like spending time in emails. I would much prefer to talk to people in my community versus just sending out a blast email to everyone.
Lisa: Right. Yeah. It's fun hearing how the ones that we're voting for, like me voting for email and you voting for community, of course, they're reflecting our strengths and our personalities. I agree with Bria. I do not use those personalization features. Number one, we all know it. It feels like a trick where it's like, hey, Lisa. And you're like, you didn't send that to me with my name. But also what's worse, if I have a list of 30,000 people, it's not clean enough. And so if you put Bria Roper in the first name field, and I say, Hi, Bria Roper, comma, and that's joltingly annoying, because now I'm trying to make a personal connection that is so falling on my head.
Brea: That's right.
Lisa: It's a horrible feeling. So whether your fields get mixed up or if there's missing data, we've all received those emails where it says, hi, first name, and you're like, oh, it just grates on me.
Brea: I would rather not send an email than send an email that, you know, comes up that way.
Lisa: Yeah, me too.
Brea: I think, oh, I just have so many thoughts. It's interesting to me that when I take the time to actually send one-off emails, like this is not an email campaign, you know, I'm emailing you manually. You know, just you. This is me typing. A lot of times people think that it's a mass email because they have received marketing campaigns. And unfortunately, like I've had that feedback and I'm like, oh my gosh, that's just me talking, you know? And so instead of trying to fight it, it's just easier for me to be in a community. They know that it's me talking to them there. They don't have to question. When I reply to this, is it going to go to her? Is it going to go, you know, where is it going to go? Like, I don't know. I just. Right. Yeah.
Lisa: And I will say to get that nurture effect, because this is all in the context of nurturing relationships, right? For email marketing, I've said really specifically, it's like, hey, this is Lisa, and I'm behind this. And if you hit reply, it's going to be Lisa. And so I've mentioned that. Yeah, because then they really do reply. And some people really spill their guts in stories. about things that are so incredible and life-changing for them. It's amazing. So when people say email marketing, oh, it's so cold. It's so generic. I'm like, I have incredible conversations with people where they share their stuff. So it has to be in the design of what you send and whether they believe there's really a human behind there they could hit reply and talk to.
Brea: Yep, that's right. And as you build, they're receiving emails from you over time. They're going to realize like, oh, this really is Lisa. I think that's really important. The relationship that you have with them can be nurtured if there's that trust there. I feel like it's hard with email alone, right? Just email by itself to build trust solely through email.
Lisa: Well, okay, this is a really good reason to support email marketing or communities for the kind of work that we do. Because if our relationship is kicked off with a coaching call or our relationship is kicked off with a workshop, they already have a personal relationship with us. And now if they come to our list, they know us as a human and it has a different effect than if somebody just started randomly getting emails from a hundred percent.
Brea: And this, This is where I can get on board with email. But for me, it's different. It's not email marketing. It really is a true nurturing of a relationship that already exists, you know. Then bring on the automation. Make it easy. Make sure that that you're continuing to stay in contact with them. But when it comes to email marketing as generating leads, just being on your website, asking people to sign up for your email list, nobody wants to sign up for another email list. So maybe that's a big difference in my mind and in my heart even is what kind of email nurturing are we talking about? Where on the journey?
Lisa: Yeah, and we're supposed to be debating here. But really, we're so agreeing. And I think the word marketing has it flagged. And I call it email marketing, because it's really what all the software providers call it, and the industry calls it right. But the truth is what I've, what I've executed over the years is nurturing relationship building and education. And maybe I've earned the right being in their inbox occasionally to announce an offer, but It's not, I'm in your box trying to sell to you constantly because that wouldn't work.
Brea: Yeah, that's right. I mean, the numbers I'm sure have changed over the years, but it used to be recommended one in every seven emails would be a call to action for money. And the other six in the sequence were true nurture, you know, of some kind. So it's probably one in 10 now, you know, where you need more nurture now than you did back then. Yeah. So I have a question for you because we are very different people in a lot of ways, and we do have some similar strengths, okay? So I'm curious. For me, emails, it's not enough interaction. That's something that with my influencing themes especially, I need that feedback from people. I need to know that I am talking to someone, that it is showing up in their inbox. And I understand we can look at analytics to see are people clicking, are people not clicking, whatever. My question is always, why not? Why didn't they click through? Was it the subject line? Was it the whatever? There are a million reasons why it might have bounced or it might have gone unread. And so I want that communication. I want that feedback. And email doesn't give that to me in the way that a community does. Is that because my connectedness is so high and yours is is lower? Is that because like, I don't know, why? Why is that that it's easier for you to just put it out there? And if people reply like that's great, but you don't need that in the same way.
Lisa: Yeah, probably. I would say part of it is going to be a cutting off of how much time I spend just goofing and talking with people because that would be super fun for me. Like if I take a physical example of this early in my career, it was really difficult when people wanted a jibber jabber in the office when you're in the same space. I felt like, wow, I'm a highly distractible person. I'm going to be kind to the person who comes in to interrupt me, but my inside voice is going to be like, oh my gosh, quit interrupting me. I have four more hours of work to do. Now I'm going to stay here until 10 PM.
Brea: I don't have that inside voice. I need that inside voice.
Lisa: So I think that same inside voice happens where Like I banned myself from Instagram for years because it's so fun to do all those interactions that I can just lose myself in that stuff and not get back to revenue generating opportunities and the operations of the business and the core functions of the business. Although community does serve part of a core function, obviously, like the relationship building part, the nurture. But I think for me, it is a little bit more of that cutting off. Like if someone's replying, with me and we're having interactions on email marketing, one, I can get what I need to get done for the day and I can put that in my email block that I have allocated for myself. Like I have this many hours in a day to reply to email, whether that's one or three or whatever it's taking at that phase of my life. And if I finish up, then I can have fun and do like longer and more engaged interactions with people. Whereas, um, If I just allowed myself to kind of be around in a community and it's pinging me all the time, I would be so distracted that I wouldn't be a business person. I would just be like, oh, let's talk in the community. So I think that is part of a managing myself preference.
Brea: Yeah, that's interesting. Yeah, because one of the things that I love about the community is that it can be real time. Like I said, I can live stream from the community, or I can just chat with the community. And if people have the notification set up on their phone, they can get the push notification and just chat right back. And that's really cool. But also or and They have each other, you know, it's kind of the difference between a group coaching and a one-on-one coaching like I don't have to be responding to all the questions because they're responding to each other and My activator loves that right? when I see that especially when I see them giving good answers to each other. I'm like, oh my gosh, you've learned, you know, like, good job, you've got it, you know, and you're sharing it with someone else. Like, that's so satisfying for me to be able to just observe, you know, and then to just like, or, you know, positivity comes in and I'm like, yeah, good job, you know.
Lisa: Yeah, I love that. Yeah, that is incredible. And you could have clients from six different companies and the four people from each of those engagements who are the most excited about strengths. Now they're connecting with each other and sharing ideas with each other and you've curated that. So I could see that being really fulfilling.
Brea: Yeah. It's so fun. Yeah. What about, so when I think of email, I also think of tech headaches and I know you love tech and I do too. When it works, it can be amazing. There are probably listeners that are like you. There are definitely listeners that are like me and for sure there are listeners who are like, I don't even know where to begin. So any thoughts about that?
Lisa: I think, I mean, one, come over to Tools for Coaches, get sequences that I've already made. Make it easy on yourself. I've already built the automations. And if you use Kit, you can import it as a whole automation. So it already has all the email sequences strung together and can just, with a click of a button, get people into that couple-year sequence. So that's one. If you really want a shortcut, come over leadthroughstrengths.com, join at Tools for Coaches. in the main menu.
Brea: I just want to clarify for people, what you're saying is you've built the sequences. Not only are they written, but they're like plug and play, pre-programmed, ready to go. So if you, listeners, if you invest in the platform kit, then all of Lisa's content is literally just push a button and it's ready to go.
Lisa: Yeah, and they'll want to customize emails probably.
Brea: The easy part, right? Like they don't have to worry about finding the right platform and integrating and you know, do I have to zap with Zapier? Do I, you know, like it's just right here. It's already done for you. Yeah. Right.
Lisa: And we'll put the link to, I have an affiliate link for kick. It's the thing. It's like the only software that I am an affiliate for cause I, Love it. It makes all of that intimidation that you're talking about. It makes it just Dissolve it allows you to tag people with certain things. So let's just take an example of CliftonStrengths You could tag them as a corporate client so that an individual one-on-one coaching client might get different content from your corporate group training people. Or maybe you tag them with their CliftonStrengths. And if they click on something that if you say like, you could write an email that has all 34 CliftonStrengths, and you could say, click on the five that are yours, you'll get tagged for it. And I'm going to send out a just info that relates to your top five. That's all a possibility and that's all stuff that you can tell it to do based on the person's behavior. If they click X, then do Y. It's so cool what you can do with it. Mine, I don't use like a newsletter where that week everyone's getting the same message. I use mine like If you're on day one of the sequence, you're on day one of the sequence. And the person next to you can be on day 30 of the sequence. And then any of the real time stuff that I need to announce, like hey, there's a webinar next week, that would be in the PS, because I can put that in the footer of the message, so that I get the benefits of a newsletter and the benefits of the automations where they're running through and pulling people through a process. And that might sound complicated, but the system, it's literally dragging visually into They call them visual automations, and you literally do these visual things. If someone gets X-tagged, then kick off this sequence, and then boom, it just does the thing for you.
Brea: Yeah, and I love Mighty Networks. Same thing, you know, they use tags. We've got automations, and so you can really personalize it. Yeah, it's interesting to hear you talk about your love for email because I get all of that. And I think what it comes down to for me is the online community. It feels more two-way to me, even though email can be that. The way that I use email and maybe the way that a lot of people use email is more of just like, I'm receiving it, it's content that I'm receiving. And I feel like with my community, at least the way that I try to run it is, it's not that, it's conversation, it's exchange. And so I'm not using the tags and the automations and the data to customize content that I'm pushing out. I'm using it to figure out how to make connections with people, who needs to meet who, you know, and everyone in the community has that data. So it's not just me. Everyone can see, you know, you can go and click on, you know, whatever strength and automatically you see whoever else has that in their top five. Like that's, cool, you know, and it's available to everyone instead of just like the man behind the curtain. So I love that, the connection that it brings, how everyone can engage together and it's more of a conversation. So here's my communication coming out.
Lisa: Communication connectedness, so surprised.
Brea: Yeah. And less of a, like, this is just a way to give information. It's really a conversation. Community, you know, really, like, that's what it is.
Lisa: Yeah. And if you take my strengths with email marketing and say, OK, here's an offer of some education or a tidbit. And then if it happens to strike you and it strikes a chord with you and you're interested, then hit reply and we'll have a conversation. And then that honors my focus and being able to stay in my focus mode, but then build a relationship with the person who is like, oh yeah, that was really cool for me, so now I'm going to engage. And then when they initiate that engagement, now we have a DM going basically.
Brea: Yeah. I think I'm realizing more that, I actually was just talking about this with, we had our podcast meetup today, so if you're listening and you haven't come to one of those, zoom on over to briaroper.com and sign up for the invites to our Zoom meetups. But we were talking about how I love equipping and empowering and encouraging coaches or business owners or the client so much that email to me feels like a distraction from that. Yeah, and community is my distraction. Oh, it's so interesting. So interesting.
Lisa: So lesson, we might have our showdown, but for you, when you're deciding as the listener, which one do I choose? Choose the one that aligns with your strengths.
Brea: And you can't say both.
Lisa: Just kidding. Okay. We're going to have to have a vote out on the community. You have to pick one or the other. Yeah.
Brea: Oh, there's so many things on my list of things that I love about the community. It's honestly, it doesn't even feel fair to like pit them against each other because they're not even the same thing. It's really not even apples and oranges. It's like fruit and vegetables. You know, I mean, they're just like different.
Lisa: Yeah. Um, different things, but we've come together in a, in a hug at the end.
Brea: How do rap battles end with a, a winner and a mic drop and ooooooooh!
“Remember, hard work doesn’t have to feel hard. Aligned with your strengths, it actually feels easy, energizing, and fun!”
MEET YOUR CO-HOSTS
BREA ROPER
Communication | Woo | Activator | Futuristic | Connectedness
If you need a Strengths Hype Girl, for yourself or your team, connect with Brea at brearoper.com. She’s ready to deliver an inspirational keynote, empowering training, or transformational workshop. If you’re looking for an expert guide to support your internal Strengths efforts, reach out today!
LISA CUMMINGS
Strategic | Maximizer | Positivity | Individualization | Woo
To work with Lisa, check out her resources for independent coaches, trainers, and speakers. Get business tools and strategy support with her Tools for Coaches membership.
The Fine Print: This podcast is not sanctioned or endorsed by Gallup in any way. Opinions, views and interpretations of CliftonStrengths© are solely the beliefs of Lisa Cummings and Brea Roper.